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Running Problem Kangoo 1.9D 2002

9K views 12 replies 3 participants last post by  ours2012 
#1 ·
Hi all, I have a 2002 Kangoo 65D 1.9D F8Q 600 Engine with the Lucas Epic Fuel Pump (semi electronic) it has no air flow sensor and the injection is mechanical.

I will try to give as much information as possible in the hope that it may aid some Diesel guru help solve the problem.

Yes it is a 600 engine, someone changed the engine earlier in its life, possibly from a Traffic. It originally left the factory with a 632 engine.

I have been trying to solve this problem for about a year now on and off.

The problem is that the engine will miss a beat every 4 seconds or so and the engine flutters as if its struggling and then continues as normal. Every so often the car will struggle to make any power at all and sound as if it is bogging down.

Usually messing about with it will make it work, but nothing inparticular seems to do the job.

The car has had new injectors, new fuel pump, new fuel lines (air was getting into them from the seals and fuel filter housing) and a new fuel filter housing. Timing belt was changed when the fuel pump was changed.

Yet the problem persists. I have heard that it could be several things but I was hoping someone on here might be able to narrow down the possibilities before I do anything more to it.

The things I have heard are, the RPM sensor in need of a clean. Chaffed wires around the area of the ECU. and faulty ECU.

I managed to get hold of an ECU from a 55D 2002 car but I havent connected it yet as I am unsure of its compatibility, maybe someone could confirm that for me.

The connector to the ECU has been messed with at some point and is held together with a zip tie. They obviously didnt know that the plastic clip to the side needed to be pulled out in order to release the connector and so broke the top of it off and its been bodge repaired.

Hopefully all of this might help in aiding a fix for the van as it is a great runner when running properly and has no other problems.

Kind regards
Paul
 
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#3 ·
going to give a quick reply ,Who fitted the pump,,is the cold start cable ie,the system only comes off choke when its hot ,has it had a new fuel pump timing solenoid fitted when the fuel pump was fitted ,,is it a new or another fuel pump?
 
#4 ·
Thanks for the reply. :)

I fitted the pump. There are no cables to the pump, it must be electronic. Timing solonoid not replaced (Is that the one on the engine side of the pump?) It was a reclaimed pump from a 45000 mile rear end accident damaged car.

Incidentely I dont think I mentioned it, it had the problem before the pump was replaced. The pump was the first thing that was replaced as Renault said it was the pump. The Renault visit was before I owned the vehicle, I picked it up from the Renault garage because it was a friends vehicle.

Update since first post, Ive taken out the RPM (TDC) sensor and cleaned it up. Problem still persists. That doesnt mean that its not faulty but I will have a new one tomorrow, from scrapped vehicle first for testing if its faulty. Car in scrap yard ran perfectly before ending up in the scrapyard it was an MOT failure on brakes and suspension parts.
 
#5 ·
Have had a look,,the engine is from a traffic,,Did you have to take the pump gear off to fit ,or were you able to fit the complete unit,,The pump thats on your kangoo now is it off a traffic or a kangoo,, as the numbers for the pump are different ,and the original pump was on its way out and this one might not be compatible,, ,,,
 
#6 ·
The pump as far as I know is the pump from the Kangoo, it ran fine for 2 years with the pump before the pump was replaced. It also ran fine once the pump was replaced. For about 2 months. The numbers on the pump were the same and it was matched with the old one.

The pump came from a Kangoo, its injectors were from a 606 engine.... yeah I know its a real frankenstein vehicle! lol The new injectors were sourced from a Kangoo which had recently had its injectors replaced before it was scrapped.

Upon removing the injectors I discovered that cylinder 2 was missing the lower injector seal. Those were replaced with new seals and all of them were fitted.

The problem appears intermittant as sometimes you will start it and drive for as long as you want it to with no problems but then the next time you start it you may or may not have a problem. It started this morning with no problems yet yesterday it was doing what is in the video.

All of the engine change I know nothing about it was done before my friend bought the car. It was bought by my friend a couple of years ago and he did 30000km in it with no problems, then it started having this problem, he took it to Renault, they said change the pump and quoted him 2000 euros, he said no chance, I said I would do it and bought the car off of him for very little money.

The chassis has just done over 200000km yet the engine I have no idea. It passed its emissions with flying colours in January which was after the pump was changed and has only done 2000km since then.
 
#8 ·
1Its the shuddering effect, it doesnt idle properly as you can see. Im not sure what you mean by knocking. It kind of stutters when that shuddering happens. As if theres something not quite right.

Ive just been out to it just now and it starts and runs but then stalls, something that hasnt happened before, so whatever it is is getting worse.

Its as if the timing is being advanced and then retarded slightly. Because the setup in the car is halfway between the fully electrical setups of today and mechanical setups of the past, its very difficult to put my finger on whats causing it.
 
#10 ·
The code you have is generic and NOT Reanault specific so may be totally misleading. Renault use a diferent protocol in their ECU's and very few code readers are fully Renault compatible. For instance one member on here used a generic code reader which showed his air-con wasn't working even though the car didn't have air-conditioning.
 
#12 ·
The reason why a MAF sensor is often the cause of this fault is due to the fact that the fault often appears on some vehicles including Mercedes Petrol models and the fault is often found to be associated with a faulty MAF sensor. This information I found out by googling for the error code and associated problems/solutions.

As this relates to a Diesel which in this case doesnt have a MAF sensor it couldnt possibly be a MAF sensor fault. It appears that as the super mod said that it is a generic related fault which is read by non renault OBDII readers. It can however also be related to a Advance/Retard Solonoid on a diesel, which is something else I found out.

As it is I have managed to clear this fault, by reverting back to the original injectors, the fault still persists however as I seem to have isolated what the problem actually is.

There is a leak somewhere on the pump where it is entering into the pump in small amounts. I have ordered a pump repair kit (gaskets) I have also decided to change out the old crappy Purflux poorly designed fuel filter canister and related pipes including the priming pump.

I will add in a one way valve between the fuel tank and the priming pump as I am replacing the whole forward piping system. I will fit the Lucas Fuel filter canister instead, that does not cause the same problems as the Purflux canister.

After speaking with a diesel specialist and now having isolating the fault by bypassing the whole fuel system excluding the pump by piping the pump into a clean fuel container with an inline filter. This removed all of the major problems with the running of the engine. It did however still have a slight fluctuation in the running from time to time. This I have now isolated down to a small leak in the fuel pump. when the affected part is pressed in there is no problem with the running of the engine whatsoever.

Thanks to all those who have attempted to help. :)
 
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