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post #6 of 15 (permalink) Old 20th April 2006
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Come on,Oily,tell everyone how you found out the Fiesta(Dads car!) was painted in synthetic.......

I still wouldn't go too hard rubbing down plastic/glass fibre panels........But,hey,painting is not my strong subject.
I leave that to Monet....(Oily)

I'd rather push my Alfa than drive a BMW....
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post #7 of 15 (permalink) Old 20th April 2006 Thread Starter
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Thanks guys, it is a bit of a shed. I'll get a pic tomorrow. It's currently in the car park at work, I daren't bring it home until it's a bit tidier or the girlfriend will go spare. She doesn't know about it yet. The panels seem relatively scratch damage free, just faded & slightly rough. 400 grit is about the starting point I reckon. My primary concern is any adverse reaction between paints & the plastic panels, I've only ever done a respray with cellulose on cellulose primer + primer/filler + a lot of finnigans no.1 (t'was a mini you see).
Does anyone know what the actual body material is ? is it simply GRP with Gel coat on top or something else ?
Anyway I shall get a pic or two tomorrow. The lichen growth around the head light wash/wipe nozzles is particularly telling .....
I keep telling myself it will be a classic soon.
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post #8 of 15 (permalink) Old 20th April 2006
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Hi Oily',

The rule of thumb I take (others may disagree), is that 2-pack can be OK over a finish that was iso-cyanate based originally. I have got away with '2-packing' directly over the original colour if nicely flatted and absolutely sound / grease / polish free.

I've never had the guts to try and put 2-pack directly over an old suspect / cellulose finish - its chemically quite aggressive and the risk of pickling always seemed too great to take the chance; (the work / delays in completely sanding off a 'reacted' car are too 'orrible to contemplate!).

Once the car is prepared and ready, the effort in applying a single barrier coat is, by comparison, negligable and cheap. Only one uniform coat is needed (don't rub it down unless you get runs - and if you do, re-coat that area.)

In my experience BarCote is almost bullet-proof against paint reaction .

You are quite right about T-Cut - works great on cellulose but 2-pack finishes are VERY hard (thats why they hold up so well), and T-Cut doesn't really touch it. There are other , better materials designed for the job, (e.g. ask you're paint shop if they have the Farecla G3 compounds), but it still takes effort - thats where the air-mop comes in!

The trick with 2-pack laquer is to get a good finish straight out of the gun - which is MUCH easier than with the old 'drying' paint systems (they shrink), whereas 2-pack cures chemically, flows better and minimises that orange-peely effect so common with is less prone to runs (within limits!).

My only problem with this type of finish is that it can look 'too good' on the wrong type of car......always felt that (say) a '68 MGB looks 'wrong' in 2pack but dead right in cellulose.... entirely different sort of finish.

My Cobra (pic I posted a few weeks back) was finished with 16 coats of cellulose over a 6 month period, with each and every coat carefully flatted with 1000 grit. It took a lot of prizes because of the paint finish which looked so deep and rich compared to the 2-pack finished cars......even though they were very shiny.

(Took a bl**dy lot of work keeping it looking like that though! - which is where modern finishes win out).

Regards m8,

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post #9 of 15 (permalink) Old 20th April 2006
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Cheers for the reply. I agree about 2K looking too good. The A35 will be done in cellulose when I get that far. The risk of using some thing containing cianide concerns me as well.......
Speak soon Oily.

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post #10 of 15 (permalink) Old 20th April 2006
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If you've a bit of experience with cellulose resprays and can live with the elbow grease needed, I'd stick with that. Some of the modern formulations are more durable and more forgiving than the older celluloses anyway. On this type of respray I must re-iterate the sense of coating the car with barrier coat it'll only add about £20 and about 2 hours work and could save you days and days of misery and a horrible 'crackle' finish car.

I take Lagdti's point about abrading plastic panels with coarser grits - but if you are flatting rather than stripping ( and you can't use paint stripper on plastic cars - melt them - yes ! ), then it shouldn't be a problem. My comments are based on just how long I perceive it would take you to flat a rough finish with 1200 grit .......ages.

Having said this........are the plastic trim panels painted or self-coloured plastic? ( I'm not sure on this car). If the latter, then I agree, there is a risk of scuffing the plastic with coarser papers and I'd move up to 600 grit on the plastic. Try it on one of the less obvious areas first to see how it takes it.

If you've no experience with 2-pack and haven't got reasonable facilities for proper ventilation then stay away from it. Belting iso-cyanate around and wafting it over the neighbour's fence is both dangerous and anti-social - and could get you 'nicked' if someone complained.

Having said this, I think the risks of isocyanates are often over-stated - the odd panel in a well ventilated room with a good face mask is probably not going to do you any long term harm. Do it regularly and haphazardly and it'll probably 'get' you after a while. Isocyanate is not the same as 'cyanide' (there are chemically similar molecules there though) but it is toxic and will absorb through the skin as well as the breathing risks. In the long term, exposure causes problems with internal organs........but then again, so will cellulose thinners!

Get you're pics up and lets see what you're up against

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