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Laguna 3 stiff steering

14K views 21 replies 6 participants last post by  Pirate! 
#1 ·
Laguna 2009 2.0 dci initiale estate - I was reversing in a straight line on smooth ground, when it appeared I hit something! I looked around the car - no dents or scratches, nothing to hit!!! But The car gave the impression of an impact. I got back into the car and the orange check ESP warning was showing and the power steering appeared not to work. I turned the engine off looked for leaks all fluids were good. I restarted and the ESP light stayed out but the steering still stiff. My local garage checked for recent faults on the ECU, but none apparent. I'm thinking that something applied the brakes to give me the impression of an impact (traction control EPC?).
HELP - I cant find any similar history of this fault and the garage is guessing it might be the steering rack, at a £1000 a pop I would like a little bit more info.
Thanks in advance
 
#4 ·
Thanks for the reply. I have not notice anything else not working. Any thoughts on what might be associated with it?
I have checked the fuses under the bonnet with a meter and all seem good, also had a look at the fuses in the glove compartment, but didn't test them all.

I've been researching ESP, is it possible the steering wheel position sensor misread the car direction (being in driven reverse), but on the brakes to correct and that has damaged the steering rack?
 

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#5 ·
can not find a steering wheel position sensor fitted to your car..
Might not even be called that knowing Renault...
Can you post your build code/vehicle type it will start with a k, followed by three alphanumerics ,, found inside your oval plate
 
#9 ·
Hi Dancing Dad,
The garage did not check the geometry as I was unaware of that issue at the time, bear in mind it was all fine before the 'incident'. The power steering is hydraulic, but I have been advised that there is an electrical connection that goes to the rack. This might be associated with ESP or hydraulic pressure/speed adjustment (wild guess).
hope that helps.
Thanks
 
#11 ·
#12 ·
The power steering reservoir is at the front, adjacent to the radiator, and it looks different to the eBay pictures (maybe the petrol and diesel cars are different! The reservoir is full to the line.
I also presume the rack will be different also.

I still need to know what has caused the problem and what the problem is.

Thanks
 
#13 ·
Esp is on because of the fault,, safety feature, your pump will still be mounted same place,, yours will have a long pipe, to allow filling , going from the reservoir to the pump assembly...can you take the top off, and turn the steering from lock to lock a few times,, does it feel easier one way,, than the other...
Unless your steering rack is bent, then it will be a pomp issue...
Would still get underneath and make sure the connector going to the pump is okay...
Might not be off, but a dirty/corroded multiplug will give you issues
 
#14 ·
Going back to my original posting, do you think that the rack has got bent during the scenario mentioned? It takes both hands to turn the wheel lock to lock as there is no hydraulic assistance at all. The guys in the garage said that they felt the pump was OK by the fact there was no noise coming from it ( did that mean it wasn't running!?). The dirty connector idea sounds good, is the pump mechanically driven by belts and electrically controlled?
 
#15 ·
The pump is an electric motor,
Can you go on my scenario ,,, you reversed the car, powers steering.pump/motor failed, but because on a slight lock, it gave the impression you had hit something..
Would that fit in..

It is not a hard job to check wiring to steering pump,,,,, hardest part is getting undershield ... Dont need to remove wheels, once under shield is off, if you follow your reservoir down you will see the pump...
 
#16 ·
Must admit to being a bit lost on this one.

But Ourkid's thought on the connections or pump motor makes sense.
If power steering fails, go to the source (pump) and work back to why.

That the wheel is slightly off centre makes be wonder on geometry but doesn't account for no power steering.

Final thought, though garages seem to condemn racks with ease, never had one fail.
 
#17 ·
OK guys, without getting the car on a ramp and removing the sump shield, I've got to take the info given and researched. had a good sleep and have a better understanding of the system now (I think) -

The steering system fitted is electric driven, electronically controlled and hydraulic powered (hybrid). The power unit is fitted at the base of the steering column with a hydraulic fluid supply, electric pump power connections and electronic control connections from various sensors. The controlling signal sensors relay steering torque rate/car speed/suspension to the ECU to direct the correct pressure into the steering rack from the pump unit.

Now ignoring the "wiring on the rack" comment from the garage and take that as wiring on the pump unit (looking at component parts available) and the valuable information so far received from responders to this thread, I have some thoughts.

1 - Is the pump running? has it got power (fuse checked)
2 - If one of the sensors has failed, it might not allow the pump to run or reduce pressure to zero?
3 - Is there a separate interrogation process of the ECU that the garage may have missed or not used suitable equipment for the job?
4 - As there is a direct connection from steering wheel to rack, the fact that the steering wheel is now "off centre in a straight line" would imply damage to the rack (also the 'mechanical bang') not sure how under the circumstances? Could it jump a tooth if rack & pinion?
5 - If the track rods or ends are damaged I would have thought it was quite obvious?

Any thoughts gratefully received - I'm an aircraft engineer dealing with Airbus for the last 25 years, even the A320 you need to sometimes just turn the power off -leave for 10 mins - fixes problems (on the ground only)
 
#19 ·
Your pump is run off the aux belt then,,, Lift your bonnet, start the car turn the steering from left to right,,..( Its easy with a helper,), Keep an eye on the pulley that is driven by the belt, for steering pump, see if it slows or tries to jam up.
Then, turn the steering wheel until its on full left hand lock,, .
You should be able to see the track rod end and inner track control arm. just behind rivers wheel
(This side did not take a hit, so should be ok). Turn on to right hand lock, you should now be able to compare the two ,,,
If its rack damage, you will see the inner track control arm, will be bent,, but not by much, this arm when new is straight, up to the track rod end...

See what shows,,,
Can you post a picture of your pump,,,
 
#22 · (Edited)
Hi there,

I took my 2007 Laguna GT 205 (who came up with the controls locations) to have a 4 wheel alignment test/adjust as my car's steering was all over the place andbI was later invited to look at the rear drive-shaft.

On the top each side are 2x bushings and it was clearly apparent that both were perished and separated from their top/bottom metal mounting plates. They told me that they were the reason that my steering was all over the place and advised that I need to have both bushings replaced and then have the 4-wheel alignment re-done.

For £15 or higher, the 2x bushings alone would be a cheap DIY solution. But no . . . as a special tool (about £40), a ramp and a mobile support cradle were required. Basically, you need to access the rear axle to access to the bushings, remove/replace them and reassemble.

I suspect this is a known issue, but if not, I hope this makes sense (as I did) as I had no idea that the car is so over egineered and has uneccessary functions is ridiculous!

Could owners advise if they've had the same/similar steering issues, and will you tell the technician to check the bushings and their findings?
 
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