Right, I've searched for this and only succeeded in further confusing myself, plus nothing I've seen so far exactly matches my problem.
Over the past week (almost exactly a week in fact) the Clio has developed an increasing reticence to start up. It doesn't seem to be a mechanical issue, as it will crank, fire and run just fine once it finally feels bothered to do it. It appears to be a variant on the "dirty key" / "dirty TDC" / "worn decoder ring" / etc problems that have filled up a whole 16 page Ask The Experts thread, but not an exact one.
At the moment, getting it going is much like starting a game of Snakes and Ladders, except with a 20-sided die instead of a d6. Gotta roll a natural 20 before it'll go. Some days I'm lucky and I get it after 3 or 4 rolls, others it can take 20, 30 or more, with me running through various permutations of putting the key in, taking it out, wiggling it, locking and unlocking the car (with and without me inside), etc, until eventually the starter noise changes signifying that fuel is going into the cylinders and I hold it in position hoping it won't stall.
I don't get a rapidly flashing immobiliser light or anything like that, but what I DO get is a steady one that doesn't go out. When it's on and all the other lights are lit up during the self test phase, the starter will run, but only for a couple of seconds, and the engine won't fire. If it goes out along with the other lights, then all's well and the car will go. But if they go off and the immobiliser light stays on, then the the starter won't run. There isn't even the quiet "thunk" of a solenoid or click of a relay, the car is completely unresponsive to the key.
(At this point maybe I should point out that what I consider the "immobiliser light" is the one noted as such in my owner's handbook - the simple red dot top and centre of the warning light cluster which flashes once a second when the car's locked)
On a few occasions, I've also been treated to a rapidly flashing "Stop engine" light (even though the engine's not going), but this doesn't seem to change the situation any, other than being an early warning that I may as well turn the switch back to "off" straight away (though I could swear I've got it going once even whilst that was flashing). The glow plugs seem to be working normally - at least, their light is going on and off as would be expected - and apart from a slight clatter, smoke and shake in the few seconds immediately after startup, the engine itself doesn't seem affected in any way.
Several of the times I've got it going, it's been by rapidly turning the key directly from "off" to "starter" without resting at any of the in-between stages, almost as if I'm catching it by surprise before it can properly check for a key code, and once the engine's actually running the security software has no way of stopping it.
However I've also had a couple times where, slightly more patient, I've tried a few things, turned it round to "run" and left it - as you would pre-heating on a snowy day - and after a few goes round the light's eventually gone out and it will start normally.
So far I've had the battery changed in the key (as the central locking range was noticeably falling off a bit and I thought that might have some bearing on matters), and it's not really done anything. I've noticed that the key tang looks a bit dirty (well in fact the silvery coating is wearing off, so cleaning it might make things worse?!), and that the problem is definitely worse with cold and damp/wet conditions. After the car's been running for more than a few minutes, it seems to become immune to the problem for a while. But if I leave it for more than about an hour, it comes back, and gets worse the long it's left standing.
The TDC was changed back in about February, when I was having both severe starting AND running problems, and it cleared things up beautifully. I doubt it's actually that this time, as there are no problems once the car's started, and it shows signs of trouble even without me trying to turn the crank over at all.
Unfortunately I have no spare key, at least, not one that I can find. I'm not beyond just buying a new one outright from the dealer (or getting one off ebay, having the tang replaced, then having them re-code it to the car), but would rather find a cheaper fix if possible which includes the decoder ring, if that can be replaced on a DIY basis.
So, any clues? :d
Thaaaaanks
Over the past week (almost exactly a week in fact) the Clio has developed an increasing reticence to start up. It doesn't seem to be a mechanical issue, as it will crank, fire and run just fine once it finally feels bothered to do it. It appears to be a variant on the "dirty key" / "dirty TDC" / "worn decoder ring" / etc problems that have filled up a whole 16 page Ask The Experts thread, but not an exact one.
At the moment, getting it going is much like starting a game of Snakes and Ladders, except with a 20-sided die instead of a d6. Gotta roll a natural 20 before it'll go. Some days I'm lucky and I get it after 3 or 4 rolls, others it can take 20, 30 or more, with me running through various permutations of putting the key in, taking it out, wiggling it, locking and unlocking the car (with and without me inside), etc, until eventually the starter noise changes signifying that fuel is going into the cylinders and I hold it in position hoping it won't stall.
I don't get a rapidly flashing immobiliser light or anything like that, but what I DO get is a steady one that doesn't go out. When it's on and all the other lights are lit up during the self test phase, the starter will run, but only for a couple of seconds, and the engine won't fire. If it goes out along with the other lights, then all's well and the car will go. But if they go off and the immobiliser light stays on, then the the starter won't run. There isn't even the quiet "thunk" of a solenoid or click of a relay, the car is completely unresponsive to the key.
(At this point maybe I should point out that what I consider the "immobiliser light" is the one noted as such in my owner's handbook - the simple red dot top and centre of the warning light cluster which flashes once a second when the car's locked)
On a few occasions, I've also been treated to a rapidly flashing "Stop engine" light (even though the engine's not going), but this doesn't seem to change the situation any, other than being an early warning that I may as well turn the switch back to "off" straight away (though I could swear I've got it going once even whilst that was flashing). The glow plugs seem to be working normally - at least, their light is going on and off as would be expected - and apart from a slight clatter, smoke and shake in the few seconds immediately after startup, the engine itself doesn't seem affected in any way.
Several of the times I've got it going, it's been by rapidly turning the key directly from "off" to "starter" without resting at any of the in-between stages, almost as if I'm catching it by surprise before it can properly check for a key code, and once the engine's actually running the security software has no way of stopping it.
However I've also had a couple times where, slightly more patient, I've tried a few things, turned it round to "run" and left it - as you would pre-heating on a snowy day - and after a few goes round the light's eventually gone out and it will start normally.
So far I've had the battery changed in the key (as the central locking range was noticeably falling off a bit and I thought that might have some bearing on matters), and it's not really done anything. I've noticed that the key tang looks a bit dirty (well in fact the silvery coating is wearing off, so cleaning it might make things worse?!), and that the problem is definitely worse with cold and damp/wet conditions. After the car's been running for more than a few minutes, it seems to become immune to the problem for a while. But if I leave it for more than about an hour, it comes back, and gets worse the long it's left standing.
The TDC was changed back in about February, when I was having both severe starting AND running problems, and it cleared things up beautifully. I doubt it's actually that this time, as there are no problems once the car's started, and it shows signs of trouble even without me trying to turn the crank over at all.
Unfortunately I have no spare key, at least, not one that I can find. I'm not beyond just buying a new one outright from the dealer (or getting one off ebay, having the tang replaced, then having them re-code it to the car), but would rather find a cheaper fix if possible which includes the decoder ring, if that can be replaced on a DIY basis.
So, any clues? :d
Thaaaaanks