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Discussion Starter #3
i tried using tesco fuel a while back, never got as near the MPG as i did with shell. Clad i dont use them.

advise to all


stick with the big petrol companies.



back to work tomorrow to fit oxygen sensors,:yawn:
 

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I wonder if a stray batch of the ethanol/petrol mix E85 has somehow made its way into the mainstream?

A bit worrying nonetheless.

I would think that the various sensors on modern cars would prevent serious damage (although £200 is serious enough for me). Its the older, more powerful cars with fixed timing (e.g. Sierra Cosworth, etc) that will probably suffer the most.

Paul:)
 

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Discussion Starter #6
nope, some car makers say its knowing to do with them, but is due to the fuel being used

thats a nice back door the car makers have isnt it:steam:
 
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It Is My Understanding That The Oxygen Sensor (also known as Lambda Sensors) Looks Like A Sparkplug And Is Fitted Near The Cat On The Exhaust System.

LOTS OF INFO ON THESE SITES

Lambdapower - Lambda Sensor mail order, UK and international Oxygen Sonde/Sonda/ Lambdasonde / Sonde de Richesse / Sonda Lambda


Some info on testing the oxygen sensor

Just Lambda NTK, Suppliers of NTK lambda sensors by post..

AND FITTING INSTRUCTIONS

Just Lambda NTK, Suppliers of NTK lambda sensors by post..

Common Sensor Faults.

Just Lambda NTK, Suppliers of NTK lambda sensors by post..

IT MAY WELL NOT ANSWER ALL THE QUESTIONS, PLEASE POST OTHER HELP SITES.


I'M SURE THIS IS NOT GOING AWAY SOON!!!!.
 

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Bad Fuel

Just watched the 6 o'clock news on BBC and guess what - they featured a report on the fuel probs from Tesco in the SE England area. Looks like somthin's up. If Tesco say their fuel is from the same supplier as every other Filling Station - then it could be a bigger problem than we think or do Tesco have a special arrangment. As the old parliamantarians used to say "something smells rotten in the state of denark". Even if they cough up and pay to repair the damage - surely somone in the fuel supply network has tried to con us all - in truth we are all victims. I live in Northern Ireland and I know I would'nt buy from supermarket stations as I've heard so many probs about them - in most case people just try another supplier and vote with their and don't go back. Further comment would be much appreciated. As my old man used to say "buy cheap and you'll end up paying twice"
 

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I work for a Renault Main Dealership and we have had 9 Upstream sensor faults in 2 days. Symptoms include...Misfires, stalling, sluggish engine, and at worst almost totally undriveable. We had an 06 Laguna affected, scenic 1 and 2s as well so most of the range can be affected.

Lambda sensors
Most Renaults since around 2001 now have 2 lambda sensors. These are situated in the exhaust pipe, 1 before the catalytic converter and 1 after the cat.
The sensor in front of the cat is refered to as "Upstream" and the sensor after the cat is known as "Downstream".
The upstream sensor is responsible for the mixture adaption and ensures the engine managment runs the engine at 14.7:1 fuel/air ratio. The sensor produces its own voltage of anything between 0 and 1000 mV. 0 being Lean and 1000 being Rich. A healthy engine and sensor will give a sensor reading consisting of fluctuations between 50mV to 950mV about once or twice a second.
The downstream sensor is a monitor of catalytic converter efficiency. This should typically stay around 400 - 500 mV. It is an indication of the oxygen storage of the catalytic converter. If this signal starts to fluctuate like the upstream, it means the cat is defective.

Whatever is in the petrol is contaminating the upstream sensor making its voltage hover around 350-650 mV and not fluctuate up and down. The engine managment reacts to this by richening up the mixture to try and get the sensor to respond (ie, the car thinks its running lean). The sensor does not move and the engine runs so rich it causes running problems.
Also, the downstream sensor may drop down as low as 20 mV. This is an indication of the Catalytic converter working overtime to burn off the excess emmisions as all the oxygen is consumed burning of excess Carbon Monoxide and Hydro carbons (Unburnt Petrol)
Having a new upstream sensor fitted will cure the problem, however, if the current fuel in the tank is not diluted with good fuel, the problem is likely to return. I have not as yet had a repeat visit, but im sure we will see one!
I hope this helps anybody!
Gareth
 

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Gareth

Thanks for that - straight from the horses mouth so to speak.

Could this batch of petrol cause a coil to give up; I've just had another one changed on the A'time (my 6th in 2.5 years)?
 
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If one of the senior members are looking at this section
please could they consider putting "GARETHW" post in the knowledge section.

Thanks
 

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Victim of bad Fuel

I live in Hastings drive a 1998 Senic 1.6RT (so out of warranty) and filled my tank last week wednesday at morrisons on Saturday on our way back from shopping, it began to crawl and judder thought the exhaust would fall off
drove about a mile like this, droped the wife and kid off and proceeded to take it to the local mechanic, but a mile in it cleared with no sign of trouble, he's not a renault mech and does'nt have the test equip so he said he could only tell when it was acting up and i should come back when it was , but from my discription he hazzard a guess "the coils", so drove back home no incident. I was on the forum looking for similar stories. pulled the Crankshaft sensor gave that a clean (iron fillings), checked the sparkplugs they seemed fine dry and gray. a mile into work on monday it slows to a crawl (15mph cutting when clutched) i think it will clear drive to work thinking i'll get a call out from there, read up more on the forums, could not drive anywere was afraid i had damaged it more by driving it 3 miles to work, caught a lift home and bused in on tuesday, called the motor factors, they stocked one of the two coils, took the work pool van and picked that coil up and a set of plugs, on one of the plugs the ceramic as brown and on all they were black and sooted, replaced the left hand coil and plugs and its running, I cant say fine although the revs fluctuate slightly. then today i hear about the fuel issue i still have 3/4 of a tank of it.

I have experienced slight loss of power on and off in the last 2weeks and i fuel at several places and morrisons is one generaly just keep a 1/4 tank.

it had felt like bubbly fuel supply then it would clear so though nothing much of it



Questions


have really fallen fowl of the bad fuel?

could my oxygen senor have been affected and caused the other parts to fail?

by replacing the coil and not knowing about the sensor have i just masked a damaged sensor that will damage the parts replaced ?

how do i remedy the fuel currently in my tank. I had less than a 1/4 before filling up have 3/4 in it right now ?

is it likely that my cat my have been fried ?

who do i complain to about the fuel ?

thanks in advance
 

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whne i took my scenic to the garage with stalling problems a few months back the garage actually mentioned they had seen a few scenics with fuel problems that had been diagnosed as sub standard fuel hence i have been careful since and only used main garage fuel (whenever possible). Sorry didn't think it was important at the time but potentially this is not the first instance of this but obviously not on this scale
 

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Renault UK are not accepting any claims under warrenty regarding lambda sensor issues. It is also recommended that the tank be drained and filled with know good fuel! How we can tell its known good fuel I have no idea!

Renault have spoken to Bosch UK about the possiblty of cleaning the sensors. Bosch say the sensors are beyond cleaning/repairing and a new one must be fitted.

Until the contaminate is identified no-one knows what the deal is. So a small request....please be kind to your dealership as they currenlty know as much as the rest of us! And thats not a lot! :)
Gareth
 
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Renault UK are not accepting any claims under warrenty regarding lambda sensor issues. It is also recommended that the tank be drained and filled with know good fuel! How we can tell its known good fuel I have no idea!

Renault have spoken to Bosch UK about the possiblty of cleaning the sensors. Bosch say the sensors are beyond cleaning/repairing and a new one must be fitted.

Until the contaminate is identified no-one knows what the deal is. So a small request....please be kind to your dealership as they currenlty know as much as the rest of us! And thats not a lot! :)
Gareth
I would just like to say thanks SOME GREAT INFO GIVEN

IT ALL LOOKS FRIGHTENING for those affected.
 
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Just listening to the bbc's six o clock news
some speculation on the fuel problems.

A higher than normal amount of silicon
has been found in some samples but this is not conclusive.

Silicon is used in the petrols manufacture to
stop the fizzing effect when filling.

It will be tomorrow when the verdict is out.
 
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