Hi i was out today in my Espace with all seats removed as i was going to move a suite today i know what my car does on cornering when dry and wet and i also know what my tyres can do on most road surfaces when wet and dry also but when all the 5 middle and backs seats are removed you lose 150kg of weight each seat weighs 30kg which i very heavy for a removable seat that my wife can't even lift or struggle to lift,the warning i have is the cars handling and cornering changes alot the under steer is out of this world it does not steer.............:crazy: i just thought i would share this with you as a warning,Drive Safe cheers Donald.
Try the back bench seat from a Chrysler Grand Voyager, They have wheels to move them and are the size of a small settee. Trouble is getting them down from the back.
Stupid or what chris thats the first time ive had mine all out at once we only ever use the 5 seats the other 2 are took out at caravan season for space that we do use but i think i will stay with the Espaces little problems rather than the voyagers fuel costs:crazy:
Best seating arrangement I have seen is the Honda Jazz all one handed no need to remove head rests folds flat, Excellent albeit a lot smaller than people carriers but a good solution.
Hi yes i look at one of them with my brothers wife very neatly done that its about time that seats in people carriers should just fold down into the floor pan god there is enough room on the espace to do this and on the friends new S Max the back two do it but i have to say they are not much of a seat compaired to my back seats there is no differance with them to the others
I think they are no good only for kids they should do both i know they do both but i would not like to see them after a good few years:crazy: if only adults using them
It is surprising how differently many cars road holding is affected by the change in weight - even the difference in having a full tank of gas can add 60 kilos or so - I hate to think what happens to american cars when the have full or near empty tanks - especially with heir soft wallowing suspensions. In Formula 1 it is always a trade off where the weight of the fuel reduces acceleration times but also reduces grip whilst cornering.
donald did you know theres a brake compensator underneath the back end on your espace alters dependant of load geuss what they sieze for fun and can make the back end very very skitish when all the seats removed ( i do this a lot throw a rubble bag in the back and take contents to the tip for myself and elderly niegbours evry couple of months and you can feel the differance on the way back )
Hi peanuts yes the load sensing valve or compensator what ever you call it?i will look into this but is this not for braking distribution when under load?all i was experiencing was under steer not braking i may wrong and if so i will wind my neck in:rofl: thanks Donald.
i guess i will go and get on my hands and knees again and have i little look:d :rofl:
The load sensing valve is for the brakes only and doesn't affect the suspension and they have a nasty habbit of seizing up and causing MOT brake failures. Additionally if it is not working properly it will affect how the car steers during braking. If you climb in below and get someone to pump the brake you should see it moving.
Hi madnoal as i said it was a turning cornering issue under steer i was not braking at the time but iam know curious if its working or not iam away to check???????:d
Hi all is well under the car so i take it that i was pushing it a bit into the corner but as i have said i take this corner everyday with no under steer and chairs out it does so its weight issue and before you have any funny comments not i do not have a weight issue:d thanks again for all your help what a bunch of great guys cheers Donald.
I must agree with Donald,I took my 5 Rear seats out on Monday.I had to go to a car breakers in Poole to get a leather interior for her BMW.It was pissing down and the A roads from Bristol to Poole are not great for the Espace,lots of hills and winding road and I had a couple of scares myself.
The seats are as Donald says ball breaking to move and I hate doing it but there was no way I was carrying 2 leather interiors back
If the seats weigh 150 kilos all that's 23 stone in my book - when we increase the load with passengers many drivers manuals recommend increasing the tyre pressures - maybe it's also a case of reducing the tyre pressure when we reduce the load.
Hi Donald - 150 kilos is equal to at least two fully grown adults and as the extra seats are very close yo the rear of the cabin their additional weight will be directly over the rear axle - so you may also have to consider what weight if any is overhanging the rear axle. As a matter of interest how much extra pressure do they recommend during an increased load. My local tyre dealer is now recommending I increase the front tyre pressures by 2 psi on the front of my Laguna II as he states in his experience it improves tyre life without reducing grip. I would be a bit loathe to do so considering any future insurance implications and it may upset the tyre pressure warning system.
Hi noel i think you have picked this up wrong from the start maybe my mistake sorry???What iam saying is the car is driving as it should but when i take all the seats out to then go to somewhere to do a job there is under steer, it is differently a weight issue as it does not do it when all the seats are back in the car or when all seven seats are even filled and when iam using the roof bars and even with the caravan is on,yes my tyre pressure do increase when 5 or more seats are being used or towing the caravan but i deflate them when i come home back to what they should be.
I appreciate what you are saying and in my days of driving vans it was more noticable when loads changed - in some case even by 25 kilos or so could make a significant difference. I am just wondering if this problem applies to all vehicles where the seats can be removed. But suppose it's something a good driver like yourself can compensate for although I could see an inexperienced driver getting caught out.:d
Hi yes your totally right i used to drive for a Heavy Haulage company in Lisburn and move some pieces of plant up to 150 tonne so yes i can feel the slightest of changes and 150kg is quite alot when the car only weighs 1600kg :d cheers all the best Donald.
I have not felt this in the Scenic II Donald when removing the 3 rear seats etc it drives just about the same bit more bounce to the rear but thats about it .