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Discussion Starter #1
Ive an issue with my Scenic 2001-03 2lt 16v F4R in that the Throttle has a mind of its own. Racing, reving, loss of idle it does it all! Ive changed the throttle Body with no success and checked over quite a lot of things already.
Im interested in the part the throttle cable goes that sends an electronic signal to the ECU. Can anybody tell me whats this part called, i cant find it listed with car part traders?
Also does anyone have the wiring diagram for this cars electrics, specifically showing the throttle and engine management components.
 

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Super fantastic Mod Technical Supremo Nice Guy
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Any Chance of a picture of what you have changed,
Its hard to visualise so we will all be struggling here
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Hello ours2002, Ive changed all the engine sensors, coils, throttlebody, checked emmision recycle canister, Im thinking the problem might lie with wiring, ECU, or this part I dont know a name for. The part that conveys the throttle signal to the ECU is what Im now going to check or replace but was wandering if someone knows what its called. Might be just called a Potentiometer transmitter or something, buts its not on the pedal, its between the throttle cable and the ECU.
The problem seams to be getting worse rapidly with it going into limp mode regularly.
 

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Super fantastic Mod Technical Supremo Nice Guy
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without a picture of what you mean , we are struggling here
Dont think you mean Idle control valve as this would come with the throttle body .
And to have the same fault would ( unlucky if you have two doing the same ) really omit this
So you have a flyby wire system ( No accelerator cable )

So it's accelerator pedal then throttle body, then Ecu

Cannot think of anything else on your system ( Assuming you have checked the sh1tty loom fitted on this engine )
The plug that goes to the throttle body, the wiring in this has a fault, It does not read the accelerator position correctly
The pins inside Open UP ., this then shows up as faults on circuit one, or circuit two .
you could Try closing them..

Doubt it will be your ECU , ( wrong symptoms )
Would be more inclined to condemn the Under bonnet fuse box before an ECU on a Scenic

Is yours Pre OBD2 also then with you not mentioning any diagnostic codes ..

with a cheap OBD reader you Might get some info,,,,, but if Pre Obd
Then its not going to be a cheap interface to use here
AND not many will read Renault


This one will, but it aint going to be a steal

 

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Discussion Starter #5
Hi ours2012, the F4R 2lt 16v doesnt have idle valves, idle is electronically regulated by the ECU to Poteniometer on throttle body. Car model has an accelarated cable which moves the throttle position sensor, Ive found the Throttle Postion Sensor is the name of part I was looking for the name of.
On this car its - Pedal - mechanical cable - sensor-transmitter-ECU-throttlle Body.
Yes I also suspect the loom which is why Im also asking if anybody could provide the wiring diagram so I can check continuity of the plugs with ECU etc.
So is the Plug on throttle body a common fault? what exactly faults with it? pins in the plug not contacting properly or wire breaks in the plug?
The throttle body is new, so its pins on that must be ok.
I have CAN which brings up fault code as Lambda, Ive replaced these to and they are working as they should according to data.
 

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ok if i'm following this yours has an accelerator cable as opposed to the later fly by wire sensor system, if this is the case have you checked the cable it self to make sure it is adjusted properly, not snagging or stretched? the symptoms you describe could tie in with a bad throttle position sensor, although this should cause a engine code to be triggered and from what i can gather you have ruled that out, failing that it may well be a vacuum leak which you should be able to hear, i would try spraying something like brake cleaner around the throttle body to see f the revs suddenly pickup as it may be a leak in the gasket if it wasn't replaced when you had the throttle body off.
we had a 2001 espace a few years back which had a bad 02 (lambda) sensor, changed it but in the time it was running with the bad sensor it caused the fuel air ratio to be off and as a result it basically burnt out the inside of the precat, which is part of the manifold (assuming the scenic has the same type), after failing MOT on emissions i put a camera in to check it and discovered it was empty, don't imagine this would cause the problems you describe, but may be worth looking at your cat's and Lambda's again as if there is one thing i have discovered over the years, its that not all problems on a car make sense and sometimes the solution is in a completely different area, after all don't forget like us cars need to breath in aswell as out, only thought of this as you mentioned the only code being thrown up being for the 02 sensors, any chance you made a note of the codes?
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Hi Patricalex, Im getting the feeling not many folk are familiar with this engine, It has a throttle cable linked to the fly-by wire sensor under the bonnet. Yes cable is correctly adjusted to fly-by wire sensor (throttle position sensor TPS).
Doesnt seem to be any vacum leaks, new carb came with new oring gasket and it was a tight fit. As the engine is reving up and down on its own I wouldnt suspect a vacum leak, I would have thought this would probably cause a steady high idle? Im definately thinking its the TPS, so will try a new one if I can get one at reasonable price. Seems these items are cheap unless its for an F4R Scenic! Will see if I can get a used one.
The cat on this car is probably finished as its still original pipe on 230K but it still passes an MOT, Id doubt the cat could cause this reving either. The codes for the lambda faults I cant remember, but checked thier working ok and that also allowed us to check the cat is reasonably ok.
It really has to be electrical fault somewhere. If anyone has the wiring diagram for this car it would be great if I could get a look at it to check the wiring. 2001 Renault Scenic 2lt 16v.
 

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sorry it has been a while since i have worked on one this old, if you have an email address i can send you the wiring diagram i have for this engine but i don't think it will allow me to post the format on here
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited by Moderator)
sorry it has been a while since i have worked on one this old, if you have an email address i can send you the wiring diagram i have for this engine but i don't think it will allow me to post the format on here
Hi, that would great if you could send it, ( Deleted now, you dont need the spam )
Ive got a Haynes manual and a CD on the Scenic which is meant to be a comprehensive lirbary of the models but neither have the wiring for this model of car.
thankyou.
 

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Super fantastic Mod Technical Supremo Nice Guy
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Guys can you PM ( Conversations its called now ) each other over your Email issues
Will delete these addresses
This is an Open Forum
 

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Throttle position sensor is the part you're looking for:

I had the same problem with our 2001 2 litre 16v Scenic and replacing the sensor fixed it.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Hi Migane Cabrio, Im heavily suspecting its the Sensor, the code I got from the Dealer for the sensor is 8200139461 and they want £120 for it!!! I wont me trying that one. Your Sensor has almost identical code bar the last number is"0", yes these are cheap Im just a bit wary to get it if it doesnt suit the car. Looks similar, has 6 contacts and same mounting design and was for same Car, but there are variotions in same car same year Ive noticed.
Is anybody able to give some firm guidence on this?
Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Just spoken to my local dealer and they have confirmed the 8200139460 is ok for my car :). Ill get one of theseand see if that cures things or not.
Im still looking for wiring info, not allowed to post diagrams on here apparenty unless thier your own. Perhaps someone can give the detail for the Sensor to ECU contact numbers and ECU to throttle body potentiometer, with colours, maybe there will be connectivity with other components between sensor and ECU but I dont think so.
Thanks
 

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Discussion Starter #17
i think Ive found out what the fault is, but will wait until im sure before a get ahead of myself. But Im convinced it was not the Accelerator Position Sensor APP. I checked it out and it seems to be working as it should. And anyhow I made some changes and car seems to be back to normal, for now anyway.
For those with the same car as mine I can provide the following info for testing the throttle circuits are working satisfactorily.

APP 6 pin plug - goes to ECU
1-white signal1, ECU pin43
2-Mauve sig2, ECU pin14
3-Brown 5v reference
4-Grey Ground
5-Ground
6-Brown 5v ref

Throttle body 6 pin goes to ECU
1-Green Ground
2-Brown 4.7v
3-White sig1 0.8-5v ECU pin62
4-White sig2 0.8-5v ECU pin61
5-Pink 5v ref
6-Brown 4.5v


Hopefully others can find help from this info. Watch you dont overload some of the circuits, I by mistake put 12v through a 5v reference and the ECU didnt like that at allo_O, but had no ill effect:) .
Also just recieved my new APP from China today, but probably will never need it, lets see.
 
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