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Discussion Starter #21
Not at all tonyrome - DL also popped me a friendly PM explaining the reasons why RF have to be super strict. ;)

(short version: the site has previously been asked by lawyers, in no uncertain terms, to remove all links or else - and the owners can't afford the else)

Back on topic? :cool:
 

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I'll hopefully be looking at the wiring to the radio on the scenic tomorrow.
Pin 1 of a standard radio din plug A should be the vss line, and the power and earth will be on other lines somewhere, so fitting should be a matter of undoing the three nuts for the dashboard top, dangling the cables to the back of the radio and then connecting up.

Sounds simple huh?

I bet that my pin1 isn't wired though, so I'll have to connect to the back of the speedo instead.

Once the vss is located I intend to get one of these just to see it working.

What would be nice to see would be the gear I'm in (the auto only displays the gear on the dashboard and in the fog today with sidelights on I couldn't make out the indicator at all) so you could see how easy that might be if you weren't otherwise busy.

ttfn
 

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Discussion Starter #23
Sounding good Sir,

fitting should be a matter of undoing the three nuts for the dashboard top, dangling the cables to the back of the radio and then connecting up
Nice! (if they've put the wires there)

Record install time so far is 20 minutes for a Mk2 MX5. 10 minutes to find a screwdriver/pliers then clean the screen and dash; 5 minutes to pull (no screws!) the trim off, 4 screws for the instrument cluster, tuck the cable into dash, clip the 3 wires on and put it all back together; 5 minutes faffing about deciding where exactly to stick that film on and stick the display down! :cool:


I've started doing some 'comic' style How To guides:

http://www.speedview.co/forum/Thread-How-To-Comic-Mazda-MX5-Mk2-NB-1-6-1-8-approx-98-00

With some decent photos and friendly speech bubbles I think they make fitting goodies child's play - once a clever more adventurous type has worked out how to do the first one anyway!

eg -





<skip a few>





 

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Ok - I've actually gone out tonight (it's cold!) to have a look and the wiring harness has a line on pin 1 of plug A (the one with the latch to one side, NOT in the middle) - which is a light grey colour, on mine anyway.

So I have ordered one and we'll see how it goes.

I could set up a video camera but I don't think it will give good results, so I don't think I'll treat this as a race if that's ok :).

Here's a question though.. what I was going to do after rough fitting (ie using tacky stuff what is blu) and calibration was to try a few different locations and see what works.
The mk1 Scenic dash is rather curvy so I need to play with location to see the effects before velcroing and putting the screen up.
Do you foresee any problems with this approach? I'm not fussed about a blurring image for calibration purposes since it's temporary and then I can make sure it doesn't get in the way of the sat nav or air vents etc.

ttfn
 

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Discussion Starter #25
Oh, gears - tricky one!

Unlike the speed, where there's a standard type of signal, there's absolutely no standard for indicating gear position on cars. Many manuals and older, hydraulic control, automatics have no electronic sensing at al.

On a manual, or a dual-clutch auto, you can "guess" by looking at engine rpm and speed. So long as the clutch is up it'll know which gear you're in. (even reverse, so long as it is a different ratio to first) Motorbike accessories often do it this way.

Autos are a no-go because of torque converter slip. No fixed relationship between engine speed/road speed and your gear ratio, so you'd have to interrogate the autobox to do it. No standards mean you're doing each vehicle individually - possible, but not at a price that makes it a practical proposition.

(budget £300/day for a fully expensed engineer and 5 days per vehicle model to work out how it does gear position, design a system to interrogate it, design the kit of parts/get it made, and test properly - then a minimum of the same again to have each design type-approved)

Surely the auto only has 'forwards' 'backwards' 'rolls away when you get out' and 'doesn't roll away when you get out' anyway... ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #26
No problem with that; try it wherever you like within reason.

Only stipulation is that you put it in peripheral vision (bottom/corner/side of eye) rather than in direct vision. Scenic has a tall screen anyhow so it'd be pretty tricky to block your view.

Legally -

MOT wise its kosher to put it wherever you like; as tints are exempt from positioning restrictions. 'Construction and use' regulations are the ones that 'prevent' you from putting it bang in the middle of your field of view. The problem with these is that they aren't hard/fast; it's up to a policeman on the day to decide whether the film (or the display) obscure your view of the road ahead, and policemen can be fickle.

I err on the side of caution and say a flat 'no' to Zone A, as that way even the most fickle chap can't object. If you were to fit the film in Zone A, but keep it very low down near the base of the screen like the OEM HUDs, then you could legitimately argue that it blocks your view of the bonnet but not the road ahead. You'd be into potentially having to argue this with a fickle policeman though, which is why I don't recommend.

I would wire the unit in then try it in all positions, either without film or with the film just taped to the screen at its edges, to see which you prefer. I'll bet that you prefer it in the corner anyway (draws your eye over mirror and centre of the road when you consult it, rather than the end of the bonnet) but the shape of the dash will dictate what looks good.
 

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Surely the auto only has 'forwards' 'backwards' 'rolls away when you get out' and 'doesn't roll away when you get out' anyway... ;)
On the Scenic auto you get a vertical list (P,R,N,D,2,1 - IIRC) which lights up with the selected gear, so theoretically it's a matter of seeing which one is sent a signal and then incorporating that into the display.
Thinking about it you're not going to be changing gear at speed, I hope, so it could just replace the '0' with the selected gear, which then gets over written when the car starts moving.

ttfn
 

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Discussion Starter #29
Not a product I'd be looking to develop to be honest.


It might be worth doing on an OBD/CANbus product (each new car is then only a day or so to get the software codes for gear position, if reported over CAN, and the physical unit wouldn't need re-approving each time) but it just wouldn't be commercially viable on older vehicles.
 

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Discussion Starter #31
Paul has uploaded his finished install guide here - all in all the Scenic proved to be a fairly painless model:

http://www.speedview.co/forum/Thread-Instructions-Renault-Scenic-Dynamique-Auto-1999-2003

Settings P8 and 100 worked well for showing the correct speed.


Where you don't want to make the connections to the car's original wiring, you can add this "ISO harness extension" lead:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Autoleads-PC2-100-4-Harness-Adaptor-Extension/dp/B0043GWBHC

By plugging the car into the extension, then the extension into the radio, you can make all the electrical connections on the extension lead so that the 'modified' part of the harness is completely removable/reversible.
 

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Discussion Starter #33
Cheeky nudge for the sunny weather - anybody else fancy tinkering?


New install technique - running the cable through the demister vent wroked well on this BMW:

 
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