[andydci]

Are there any known issues with the gearbox's on scenic dci (2001 105hp 1.9 model with 5spd box) causing a sudden oil leak?
having never left any oil on the floor before, last night it had left a 6"x4" puddle of gear oil in the space of 2.5 hours...
Left an old cloth under it last night when i got home to catch any eveidence and will shortly be going out for a quick look.

 

[madnoel10]

Check the driveshaft gaitors at the gearbox.

 

[andydci]

Well its all very odd, not a drip since!
Cheers noel, not that, nor any of the fill/drain plugs on engine or box, actually appears to be the crank end seal, the oil is concentrated at the bottom of the engine/box interface. Although there has been no further puddles or drips, the aforementioned area is wet through with oil, but upon looking through the drain holes the oil appears to be on the engine behind the flywheel.
It looked way too clean to be engine oil!
The engine oil level had dropped too, reading 1/3 on the dipstick, now topped up. Will keep an eye on it and maybe as a temp measure try some 'stop leak'.
Can't afford atm to get it sorted, and not currently working in a garage don't have suitable facilities to do it myself. (don't like paying for someone to do a job I can do myself, but i can't spend days fannying about trying to do this kind of job with axle stands in a carpark! I trust the garage where I used to work though, so would take it there. I think the clutch feels ready too... so while in Rome...)

 

[andydci]

... Unless its the driveshaft seal on the box, the oil does go up the back where I can't see, suspected creepage, but could also be creepage from the bottom up through onto engine...
My old Citroen zx td was a bugger with that, when you did a bottom arm or balljoint on the nearside the shaft would pop out bringing the seal with it and piddling oil, though the seal would also go back in nicely along with the shaft and not pop back out or dribble! :d I loved that car!!

 

[madnoel10]

If oil in the engine/gearbox interface area looks too clean to be engine oil I would suspect the clutch thrust bearing has sprung a leak. The hydraulic clutch mechanism contains little fluid - maybe that' swhy it has now stopped. It may be on the point of being empty. It may be your suspicions regarding the clutch may be correct.

 

[andydci]

It's a cable clutch on these mate. (plus i know the feel of brake/clutch fluid on the fingers, not that its relevant not being hydraulic!)
Nothing still re-appeared...
As for the clutch, tis hard to quantify, just feels a bit 'grabby' and tends to squeel a little when letting it out quickly (not release/thrust bearing screech), which seems that the grooves/segments have worn off leaving a smooth, complete surface. The back of the flywheel is dry and has surface rust fwiw so doesn't seem as though the oil has contaminated, unless the oil has passsed the seal on the input/first motion shaft from the box of course...

 

[madnoel10]

Gearbox oil has a very distinctive odour - much different to that of engine oil or brake fluid.
A contaminated clutch plate will feel grabby or possibly even squeal when warm. It is not unusual for leaking oil not to reach the back of the flywheel as the centrifugal forces will tend to prevent creepage.


As a matter of interest what year is your car?

 

[andydci]

2001 'Y' just approaching 66k.
Yeah i know the gear oil smell, didn't sniff it actually, but I replaced with fully synthetic which smells a bit different. (I know these boxes can be a little delicate which is why the switch to fully)
The litre of gear oil i ordered should be here this week, I'll then find somewhere level to check it (didn't leak enough for level to be a worry yet)
Think it must be engine oil though as the level had dropped a lot and it hasn't really used any at all in the past.
I suspect as it has done really low miles (<62k at purchase in january), considering the age of the car, the seal has probably hardened with lack of use, and due to my constant & 'nippy' driving since purchase, has worn away as it can't flex properly with the (albeit very minute) movement of the crank journal.
As for the contamination or not of the clutch my thinking was if it isn't on the flywheel I can't see it getting into the clutch, unless it was coming from the 'box, or are these flywheels drilled at the centre around the bolts)?. (It squeels (or rather 'hoots' like an owl) briefly when letting out quickly at any temperature.)

 

[Nigelvm]

Hey, did you fixed the problem, I also have the same problem with my clio 1.2 Grande... leaks oil, looks as if its coming from the gear box (some kind of seal maybe - im no mechanic) but my engine oil level does drop quite a lot, the oil which is coming out is very clean and kind of yellowish colour, I am taking the car to be looked at tomorrow, Hopefully it will be good news!

 

[OzRX4]

WHich side of the car was the leak from if you could tell??

I'm going with the inner left side driveshaft boot. If it was clean looking oil, most definatly gearbox fluid.

I would check it very carefully for leaks. I will say, by the sounds of the speed of the leak and given there is no signs of the leak now, it's certainly the driveshaft seal.

It's an easy change for the new one actually, just need to drop it off somewhere with a press. Boot cost for you blokes would be around 10quid I'd guess.

Any help you need for info on the swap you can send me a messgae.

I hope I have caught you before you refilled the gearbox too, as it'll run out quite quick.

The fully synthetic oil worries me too, has it performed OK??

 

[andydci]

I'll double check mate sure.
When you say left, do you mean from front of car (offside) or from inside car (nearside)?
Also what do you mean by 'worry' about the fully synthetic??
Cheers!
Ps I get the odd couple of drips left every 'blue moon'.

 

[adamh108]

Andy my scenic has 120k on the 1st clutch now, it has screeched under load now since i got the car 3 years ago at 80k. The clutch will be fine for a long time to go and the noise wont get any worse. It just that the grease has dried up on the release bearing. Not a big deal. Wait until the clutch is slipping i say.

 

[andydci]

Cheers. Its not the release bearing though!
FYI anyone, I am a former mechanic, just not worked in the trade for 12 years so need to check on here as these vehicles were not coming in when I was active and thus have no knowledge of them.
I have always worked on my own vehicles, friends/relatives & colleagues vehicles, and even taught mechanics to a couple of folk too.
Cheers for any assistance provided, and I welcome any! Its useful to chat with others in the know too such as noel for example.
BTW Adam, great vid(s?) on the gear oil change and stuff, helped me out simply to locate the fill/drain plugs!

 

[andydci]

Well cheers folks, think I've nailed it down to two things, crank end oil seal or sump gasket.
Just had a good close inspection, none of the driveshaft seals or boots are leaking, and also I have found the box and bellhousing are seperate. The oil is coming from engine behind flywheel and out the drain holes and flange seam. over other side of bellhousing where it bolts to box it is bone dry around the whole seam, now it could be sealed I guess but usually such things are just face to face bare as there is no need for a seal.
Other thing I have found is that sump is semi structural, it form the lower third of the engine flange for the bellhousing, so that'll be a tw*t probably to remove...
So all is well (enough) for my 3h journey to the lakes next week

 

[Nigelvm]

WHich side of the car was the leak from if you could tell??

I'm going with the inner left side driveshaft boot. If it was clean looking oil, most definatly gearbox fluid.

I would check it very carefully for leaks. I will say, by the sounds of the speed of the leak and given there is no signs of the leak now, it's certainly the driveshaft seal.

It's an easy change for the new one actually, just need to drop it off somewhere with a press. Boot cost for you blokes would be around 10quid I'd guess.

Any help you need for info on the swap you can send me a messgae.

I hope I have caught you before you refilled the gearbox too, as it'll run out quite quick.

The fully synthetic oil worries me too, has it performed OK??

Thanks for the advice I think I found where it was leaking, the seal where the gearbox fits to the engine, so I sealed it which temperature seal 250 degrees (temp job) I also noticed that there is a plastic casing under there and if u move it abit you can see some kind of cog not sure exactly what its for but did not have signs of oil on it or has been on it at all although there was no oil coming from the plastic casing or near it, I have another problem which I have to fix as well, Oil is also coming out of the Oil filter very slowly and it looks pretty clean compared the oil when I check my oil level, my oil level in the engine does drop quite fast compared to my friends Clio so I'm guessing the oil is being filtered and then coming out of the oil filter as it looks clean, I am also guessing this is where the clean oil was coming from, maybe it has been coming from there and dripping down and as I'm travelling it is moving under the car to different places making it look like its leaking else where, not to worry though as I am sorting it out tomorrow, giving it a full service

 

[andydci]

Seems mine was just an anomally, or someone elses puddle which appeared new!
The underside is still oily but has never since left anything on the floor.

 

[madnoel10]

All oil leaks should be investigated and I have yet to see an oil leak that cured itself. It's when they stop of their own accord worries me as it usually means the source of oil has been exhausted.

 

[andydci]

It was thoroughly investigated, the gearbox is full and the engine oil kept topped up. It never leaves any on the floor, is just weepage from the crank end oil seal. The supposed leak was either, someone elses puddle that somehow managed not to disperse in the usual fashion, or some random unlikely circumstance caused a one off anomally. the car has done a couple of thou+ since the occurance, I check underneath 8/10 times and always tend to notice any puddles out of my peripheral vision anyway which is how I saw the one that day.
(and it wasn't power steering fluid or coolant either!)
Did have a D'oh! moment a few days after though, reversing out of supermarket carpark bay there was a huge puddle left followed by trickles/drips, sh1t I thought... Upon checking, it was water, it was a scorching hot day and I'd had the air con on full for about an hours driving before parking up hadn't I... :-S